Filters into "Hide X" options

[Peeter Tinits]

Introduction -> Sections

"Don't show" -> " Hide"

In two places, below on the interface & in the preferences

[Andrjus Frantskjavitsius]

Currently all filters show less content when ticked. They filter out the information.

Am I missing something?

[Peeter Tinits]

Ok, what about reversing them all. So that all of them include more content when ticked - and will all be ticked by default.

Can't figure out how to say "Introduction only" with "Don't show".

[Peeter Tinits]

So, instead of filter, you would also have on the GUI, all of them as "Show X". This would maybe be easier to understand. Filter is an unusual word, and should be written even "filter out" on each case maybe.

Then they would all be just display properties, which indicate how much is shown. Easier on the user I think.

[Peeter Tinits]

There is an ambiguity in the verb "filter" in my opinion, which for me is argument to use "Show x" instead.

"Filter files" - for me the first intuition is that you clean files of something, ending up with cleaner files. "Filter out files" would be unambiguous, but at the same time longer and clumsier.

The user does not have to know how the software works, it doesn't matter whether it is specified as "filtering out" or "showing" for them. Personally "showing" seems an easier to understand option. Just to make the case - up to the collective to decide.

v. fil·tered, fil·ter·ing, fil·ters

v.tr.

1. To pass (a liquid or gas) through a filter.
2. To remove by passing through a filter: filter out impurities.
3. Computers To use a filter to block or restrict access to: a program that filters spam.

v.intr.

1. To pass through or as if through a filter: Light filtered through the blinds.
2. To come or go gradually and in small groups: The audience filtered back into the hall.

[Kristian K]

What is the context of this all? Is it somewhere in the preferences pane? Somewhere in the menus? Somewhere else?

I can see the point Peeter is making, that in Estonian filtering something out (filtreerima, sõeluma) means getting the thing filtered out, meanwhile in English it is the opposite.

I still think "filter" is a good name for the category of stuff we talk about.

[Kristian K]

If it is about the preferences pane, I think it is quite okay to do both words -- filter and show:

Filters: [x] show templates [x] show files [x] show only 1st paragraph [x] show only citations

[Peeter Tinits]

I meant generally, whereever we use filters. The meaning of filter in English is the same (see meaning 1 above). If you filter water, it means that you clean water of some stuff. The third meaning seems to be for computers only. But I meant exactly that, yes. Thanks!

True, it could be both.

If it would be both, I would use:

Filters: [x] show templates [x] show files [x] show the whole article [x] show citations

So that "show" = always more. They can all be ticked at the start (= no filters used).

[Kristian K]

I think "show only ..." is much more understandable and more coherent. The "Show the whole article" is odd. If "Show only first paragraph" then each filter description uses a coherent sentence with show only.

Anyway, @peeter_t2. What is under discussion here is twofolded: 1) program logic 2) how that logic is represented in a human language on a screen or paper

You shouldn't mix the two and you should never take English as the primary language of either of them.

Making my point, we should actually consider whether MT is ready for languages with right-to-left scripts instead of what we take for granted, e.g left-to-right languages. Here's an excellent short The Twisted Road to RTL (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qmLdHuFRGgM)

[Peeter Tinits]

Yes, here I was considering only point (2). Point (1) - program logic - is not necessarily relevant to how the user interface should be designed. That is, the user doesn't have to know how the program does what it does.

I understand your point about show the whole article being odd. The alternative is also a bit odd though. (Btw as far as I understand, it is not the first paragraph, but just everything before the first heading? "Show only summary" would be closer. Previous was "introduction". Let's discuss and solve this once and for all tomorrow.

RTL sounds like amazingly difficult! No idea how to get that far personally... I've seen a clip on how they implemented code-mixing with that... crazy stuff.

[Andrjus Frantskjavitsius]

Done