Graphics filters (ie. hq2x)

[Former user]

Original issue 78 created by [e-mail] on 2010-04-22T11:15:35.000Z:

I think summary explains it. I understand from overseeing OpenTyrianWii
that stuff like HQ4X are ridiculous due to screen resolution of Wii, but
would it be possible to add such filters to Genesis Plus GX?
I'm amazed how much better Crue Ball looks with hq2x on Kega Fusion and
was wondering why there is currently nothing of that sort on the Wii
(besides bilinear filter).

[Former user]

Comment # 1 originally posted by ekeeke31 on 2010-04-22T14:25:22.000Z:

[Former user]

Comment # 2 originally posted by ekeeke31 on 2010-04-22T14:25:47.000Z:

[Former user]

Comment # 3 originally posted by ekeeke31 on 2010-05-25T06:49:52.000Z:

[Former user]

Comment # 4 originally posted by Gamewizard71 on 2010-06-25T01:56:33.000Z:

openbor has graphic filters maybe their source will help

[Former user]

Comment # 5 originally posted by [e-mail] on 2010-06-25T04:59:20.000Z:

OpenTyrian had graphic filters as well but the way they've implemented it, it doesn't work too well on the Wii in terms of speed and efficiency, this is why I'm not totally optimistic about this sort of thing happening, but if it is possible for eke-eke to implement such a function it'd make the emulator a real crown jewel, you know? :D

[Former user]

Comment # 6 originally posted by ekeeke31 on 2010-06-25T06:39:55.000Z:

Thank you but most software filters are open-source and I already have the sourcecode for the ones I need (hq2x, scale2x, sai2x).

That's said, I think original mode already IS the crown jewel for this emulator, it's something you cannot find on any other platform (incl. Xbox emulators I think, correct me if i'm wrong) and make all these destructive filters useless (providing your TV can support it off course hence why I'm planning to eventually add software filtering options). Personnaly it hurts my eyes when playing an emulator with HQ2X or Super Eagle enabled after having played on the real thing ;-)

[Former user]

Comment # 7 originally posted by [e-mail] on 2010-06-28T06:12:40.000Z:

I dont have the real thing myself anymore since it refuses to turn on after plugging in the RF cable (which looks like it has a lot less prongs than what it should). I can't say for Super Eagle but I mentioned Crue Ball before because it really does look better using HQ2X, I really think visually how it is depends on brightness settings of the PC, speed handling and the actual game itself (graphic filters wont make better graphics out of graphics that were crap to begin with). As for XBOX Emulators, I wouldn't even try comparing this project to theirs - this one is clearly superior. It is easier to obtain and run (no hax needed to install homebrew) and is easier to set up and use, is still in development and probably has more functionality. A quick look at trying to get homebrew on my own XBOX some time ago showed that without even needing to get it running.

[Kerin Millar]

Comment # 8 originally posted by kerframil on 2012-04-12T00:28:29.000Z:

Couldn't agree more with comment 6. I use original (240p) mode with a Micomsoft XRGB-Mini and it's wonderful. In my view, a much better option would be for Genesis Plus to allow for the simulation of scanlines in 480p mode so that 1080p LCD users can enjoy a more authentic look without necessarily having to buy an specialized upscaler. All it would need to do is to perform pixel-perfect 2x scaling and darken the odd lines, preferably with the brightness being under user control.

[Former user]

Comment # 9 originally posted by [e-mail] on 2012-04-12T01:37:03.000Z:

That's more-or-less the idea I had. Original mode is definitely the way to go but it looks nasty IMHO on newer TVs especially ones with that weird interpolation thing. Not sure why that happens because nothing else looks interpolated but the games and stuff tend to show afterimages as a result. Probably a local issue but I imagine some more options to tinker with couldn't hurt.

[Kerin Millar]

Comment # 10 originally posted by kerframil on 2012-04-12T03:11:26.000Z:

There are various problems that can occur with modern TVs. Ideally, a 1080p TV should upscale in a linear fashion i.e. neatly doubling 480 pixels to 960 and vertically centering. On Sony models that is possible provided that one sets "Display Area" to +1. Otherwise, it will vertically stretch to 1080 and that's really not desirable in terms of trying to preserve the nuances of 240p graphics, \*especially\* when scanlines are being emulated (even if the scaling is good, artifacts will occur in many games). I think another issue is that some TVs treat 240p as 480i and apply crappy de-interlacing where it is simply not necessary, leading to strange effects. I've seen evidence of that when using the SCART input on my Sony TV, whereas 480p over component is fine.

In any case, the Wii is effectively limited to 480p and there's no magic that an emulator can pull off to fix a bad TV. Still, the mechanics of having an emulator line-doubling the framebuffer and inserting pixel-perfect scanlines prior to output aren't overly complex though. That would be great for anyone with a half-decent TV without having to splash out for a Micomsoft upscaler like I did ;) I really wish that more emulator authors would take care of these nuances. Hats off to eke-eke for being ahead of the curve and supporting true 240p in all his emulators. The only other emulator I know of that gets it right is wii-mednafen.

[Former user]

Comment # 11 originally posted by swsparklewind611 on 2012-07-09T15:17:14.000Z:

For a somewhat CRT-like experience, I suggest looking into this thread: http://board.byuu.org/viewtopic.php?f=10&t=147

Some of the samples, especially in the first post, look amazing, and the look should be preferable to simple scanlines. I still haven't seen a real filter/shader that replicates this look, but if any coder is interested it would be really awesome if he/she could pull it off. I find filters that try to curve the picture odd though. I still won't use the CRT TV that I have because the flat glass on top of the curved glass makes it look odd.

[Kerin Millar]

Comment # 12 originally posted by kerframil on 2012-07-09T15:27:48.000Z:

Re: Comment 11 - that's an interesting filter but I don't see how it can be implemented in a Wii emulator because it relies upon being able to scale the original image by 3x. If the Wii happened to support 720p, it would be a different matter (3 x 240 = 720).

[Former user]

Comment # 13 originally posted by swsparklewind611 on 2012-07-09T16:00:47.000Z:

I'm not a coder, nor a painter, by any means, but this sample includes phosphor2x: http://img199.imageshack.us/img199/627/phosphornxgng.png

That should theoretically work for 240 games upscaled to 480, if the number of pixels is doubled, although how it will work in practice considering there is no real filter/shader that is actually usable in an emulator yet and that replicates this well (That I'm aware of), I don't know. Having it relatively flexible could also make a difference, since some games use a smaller resolution than 320x240, plus the fact that pretty much all LCD's that are released today are 16:9, and 480p in widescreen is 720x480 if I'm not mistaken.

[Kerin Millar]

Comment # 14 originally posted by kerframil on 2012-07-09T16:52:51.000Z:

Ah, I didn't notice that there was a 2x variant! Yes, that would work with 480p - assuming the Wii has the horsepower to pull it off. The sample looks quite good, given the limited resolution. If you try that particular filter with a PC based emulator running at 640x480 over VGA, it should be a good indicator of what an implementation might look like on the Wii.

16:19 support on the Wii is anamorphic; the display merely stretches the image along the horizontal axis if configured to do so. That's neither useful nor desirable for emulation of 240p consoles. The maximum framebuffer resolution remains the same which, if I recall correctly, can be 640x528 at the most.

[Former user]

Comment # 15 originally posted by swsparklewind611 on 2012-07-10T10:14:54.000Z:

Yes, if there's an implementation for RetroArch I could definitely try it on my PC. Component is almost as good as VGA, plus there's a port of Genesis Plus GX for RetroArch, so that should certainly be quite an accurate indicator of what it might look like. And I agree that the sample looks good even with 2x, definitely better than plain bilinear filtering or scanlines.

Oh, I never noticed. I'm always using the 16:9 mode if I can, and the games that support it don't look stretched or anything to me (Rather they look like they are in a higher resolution), and menus in some games for example seem to have more unused space in 16:9 mode. Maybe there's some sort of compensation going on? Or I just didn't analyze it enough. Anyway, if what you're saying is true then it would indeed not be useful or desirable. There are still games that are in a lower resolution than 320x240 though. Sonic the Hedgehog 2 for example uses a lower resolution with different proportions in the special stages, and this I think would normally be stretched to 4:3 on an SDTV. I just thought it'd be good to mention this, since a lot of filters in emulators seem to break whenever an "odd" resolution is used. I've seen this with SNES emulators whenever a game goes into "hi-res" mode for example.

[Former user]

Comment # 16 originally posted by ekeeke31 on 2012-07-12T20:32:51.000Z:

[Kerin Millar]

Comment # 17 originally posted by kerframil on 2012-07-28T00:14:48.000Z:

Re: Comment 15, for confirmation that 16:9 mode is not a good thing, look at eke-eke's comments in issue \#24 and issue \#66. In native Wii games that support it, what you get is an increased field of vision but not an increased resolution (the opposite, in effect). That's a reasonable tradeoff for 3D games.

[Former user]

Comment # 18 originally posted by swsparklewind611 on 2012-07-30T18:23:13.000Z:

You're probably right. I guess I haven't been paying enough attention to notice. I won't change the setting for my native Wii games though because the 16:9 proportions outweigh the benefit of using a higher resolution in this case. I can see how 16:9 would be bad for MD emulation however, since they are originally made in 4:3.

[Kerin Millar]

Comment # 19 originally posted by kerframil on 2014-11-14T01:05:56.000Z:

There's a modified version of the Retroarch port that supports scanlines via an overlay:

https://gbatemp.net/threads/retroarch-wii-updated-cores-and-stuff.362826/

I tried out the genplus-gx core in this version, using the "scanlines.png" overlay. With the resolution set to 640x480p in retroarch, the results are really good for as long as the image is still. Unfortunately, there are scaling artifacts as soon as there is any motion, especially along the vertical axis. I wasn't surprised because scaling is handled really badly in the Wii port. Still, it is a tantalizing example of what might be possible if it were implemented correctly.