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SCons / BugParty / IrcLog2008-08-11

19:01:05  <[GregNoel](GregNoel)>     Hey, it's time.  We three seem to be here; anyone else for the bug party? 
19:01:11  <garyo-home>   So... is it just the 3 of us tonight? 
19:01:52  <stevenknight> hmm, no sign yet of Brandon or Bill 
19:03:16  <stevenknight> anyway, shall we dive in to the current issues? 
19:03:20  <garyo-home>   Yes please. 
19:03:23  <[GregNoel](GregNoel)>     I'm ready 
19:03:40  <[GregNoel](GregNoel)>     2124, no Brandon... 
19:03:58  <stevenknight> 2124: defer 
19:03:58  <garyo-home>   Race conditions: Steven, do they go away w/o a virus scanner? 
19:04:08  <stevenknight> not sure, haven't had a chance to check 
19:04:12  <garyo-home>   ok. 
19:04:21  <stevenknight> leave 2124 w/Brandon 
19:04:34  <stevenknight> I may end up diving in to solve my own problems 
19:04:35  <[GregNoel](GregNoel)>     2124, defer but if Brandon doesn't show up, we make it research 
19:04:45  *      bdbaddog (n=[bdeegan@adsl-71-131-3-114.dsl.sntc01.pacbell.net](mailto:bdeegan@adsl-71-131-3-114.dsl.sntc01.pacbell.net)) has joined #scons 
19:04:52  <[GregNoel](GregNoel)>     Hey, Bill 
19:04:55  <garyo-home>   Hi Bill. 
19:04:59  <stevenknight> but given how much i have going, don't want my name on it to prevent others from making progress 
19:05:07  <[GregNoel](GregNoel)>     concur 
19:05:08  <bdbaddog>     Good evening! 
19:05:10  <stevenknight> hey bill 
19:05:17  <garyo-home>   We're just getting going. 
19:05:22  <stevenknight> 1500: 
19:05:35  <garyo-home>   wontfix. 
19:05:36  <[GregNoel](GregNoel)>     wontfix, steven 
19:05:38  <stevenknight> i'll WONTFIX like i said i would 
19:05:58  <garyo-home>   ok. 2161 
19:06:00  <stevenknight> 2161 
19:06:14  <garyo-home>   I think this should be low pri. 
19:06:20  <stevenknight> i'm agnostic, my 1.x p3 is partly real, partly just to re-evaluate it later 
19:06:30  <stevenknight> agree re: low pri 
19:06:40  <[GregNoel](GregNoel)>     I'd push it straight to future 
19:06:45  <garyo-home>   Someone who wants it & understands it needs to drive it. 
19:06:45  <stevenknight> bill, you object to 1.x p4? 
19:06:53  <stevenknight> or future?  i could go there 
19:07:07  <bdbaddog>     nope that's fine. 
19:07:16  <garyo-home>   ok. 
19:07:19  <[GregNoel](GregNoel)>     what pri? 
19:07:31  <garyo-home>   p4? 
19:07:34  <[GregNoel](GregNoel)>     I'd suggest p2 or p3 
19:07:35  <stevenknight> p4 
19:07:37  <bdbaddog>     p4 
19:07:42  <[GregNoel](GregNoel)>     p4 it is. 
19:07:54  <[GregNoel](GregNoel)>     2159 
19:08:00  <garyo-home>   2159: greg, 1.0.1 
19:08:17  <[GregNoel](GregNoel)>     consensus 
19:08:31  <stevenknight> done 
19:08:33  <stevenknight> 2160: 
19:09:02  <[GregNoel](GregNoel)>     Who's an AIX guru? 
19:09:14  <garyo-home>   not me, sorry.  Ask on the list? 
19:09:23  <bdbaddog>     not me. 
19:09:27  <[GregNoel](GregNoel)>     and not me 
19:09:57  <[GregNoel](GregNoel)>     Asking on the list might yield nothing; what do we do if noone shows up? 
19:10:14  <garyo-home>   ask original poster for a patch, I guess 
19:10:22  <stevenknight> that sounds good 
19:10:26  <[GregNoel](GregNoel)>     Er, that would be me. 
19:10:35  <stevenknight> then it sounds doubly good! 
19:10:36  <garyo-home>   oops. 
19:10:44  <stevenknight> :-) 
19:11:00  <garyo-home>   Then I guess we guess or else do nothing. 
19:11:08  <[GregNoel](GregNoel)>     I just noticed the problem when I was looking at [GetBuildPath](GetBuildPath) for our last party 
19:11:30  <[GregNoel](GregNoel)>     and wondering what the implications of deprecating it would be 
19:11:44  <stevenknight> just a guess from looking at the code, it looks like it should be an argument of '.' 
19:12:10  <stevenknight> give it to me, i think i can figure out something semi-reasonable to do 
19:12:22  <[GregNoel](GregNoel)>     OK, low priority? 
19:12:25  <stevenknight> most likely involving getting rid of the [GetBuildPath](GetBuildPath)() call in favor of Dir() 
19:12:27  <stevenknight> yes, p4 
19:12:43  <[GregNoel](GregNoel)>     or even 2.0? 
19:12:49  <garyo-home>   OK, but without an actual AIX user it won't be much good.  p4 1.x or 2.x 
19:12:56  <stevenknight> right 
19:12:58  <[GregNoel](GregNoel)>     2.x p2 
19:13:03  <stevenknight> done 
19:13:12  <stevenknight> 2162:  consensus 1.0.1 p3 gregnoel 
19:13:25  <[GregNoel](GregNoel)>     done 
19:13:31  <stevenknight> 2163:  1.0.x, p?, who? 
19:13:38  <[GregNoel](GregNoel)>     (my google connection just crashed?) 
19:13:43  <garyo-home>   mine too! 
19:13:53  <stevenknight> ditto... 
19:14:17  <bdbaddog>     gmail and google apps for domains were out for a bit mid day today. 
19:14:25  <stevenknight> not sure what's going on today, i heard gmail had problems that caused a stir 
19:14:32  <[GregNoel](GregNoel)>     Ah, it's back... 
19:14:36  <stevenknight> ditto 
19:14:39  <garyo-home>   2163: since none of us can test it it doesn't matter who puts in the patch.  I can do it. 
19:14:45  <stevenknight> garyo++ 
19:14:50  <[GregNoel](GregNoel)>     done 
19:15:05  <garyo-home>   But I'm not the borland guy :-/ 
19:15:11  <garyo-home>   just saying. 
19:15:29  <garyo-home>   2164: same thing.  I'll take that too. 
19:15:37  <stevenknight> 2164:  garyo, thanks 
19:15:46  <[GregNoel](GregNoel)>     good 
19:16:12  <[GregNoel](GregNoel)>     2165 
19:16:13  <stevenknight> 2165:  leave w/me, or combine with the other race condition, or? 
19:16:22  <garyo-home>   2165: Steven, can you merge that into the other race cond ticket? 
19:16:26  <stevenknight> sure 
19:16:48  <garyo-home>   ok.  2166: 1.0.1 greg p2? 
19:17:05  <stevenknight> done 
19:17:07  <[GregNoel](GregNoel)>     done 
19:17:24  <stevenknight> 2167:  i'd like 1.0.x 
19:17:34  <stevenknight> probably 1.0.1 
19:17:44  <stevenknight> transition to subprocess and kill our home-brew stuff asap 
19:17:40  <[GregNoel](GregNoel)>     it's not a regression 
19:17:49  <stevenknight> *sigh* -- good point 
19:18:00  <[GregNoel](GregNoel)>     I agree that it's important, but I'd make it 1.x p2 
19:18:05  <garyo-home>   would you be ok just integrating this patch or should we do the spawn -> subprocess switch all at once? 
19:18:05  <stevenknight> 1.1 then? 
19:18:12  <garyo-home>   yes, 1.x p2. 
19:18:15  <garyo-home>   sure 1.1. 
19:18:18  <bdbaddog>     sounds good. 
19:18:21  <stevenknight> done 
19:18:30  <stevenknight> i'm okay with just the patch -- incremental steps are fine 
19:18:31  <[GregNoel](GregNoel)>     I'm willing to convert to subprocess incrementally 
19:18:37  <garyo-home>   ok, good. 
19:18:46  <[GregNoel](GregNoel)>     who? 
19:18:46  <stevenknight> 1.x p2, who? 
19:18:49  <garyo-home>   Then I'll do it. 
19:18:52  <stevenknight> okay 
19:18:53  <[GregNoel](GregNoel)>     done 
19:19:15  <stevenknight> 2168:  anytime, p2, stevenknight 
19:19:20  <[GregNoel](GregNoel)>     done 
19:19:31  <[GregNoel](GregNoel)>     but not until 1.0 is out... 
19:19:35  <stevenknight> right 
19:19:31  <stevenknight> 2169:  1.0.x, p3, garyo 
19:19:37  <garyo-home>   2169: I'll take it. 
19:19:44  <[GregNoel](GregNoel)>     done 
19:19:57  <stevenknight> 2170:  1.0.x, p2, stevenknight 
19:20:06  <[GregNoel](GregNoel)>     done 
19:20:21  <stevenknight> 2171:  1.0.x, p3, stevenknight 
19:20:44  <[GregNoel](GregNoel)>     ok, and depends on 2170 
19:20:50  <stevenknight> right 
19:20:58  <stevenknight> 2172:  let bill and greg arm-wrestle for it... 
19:21:05  <stevenknight> anytime p2 
19:21:31  <[GregNoel](GregNoel)>     I'll do it 
19:21:38  <garyo-home>   google's down again 
19:21:54  <[GregNoel](GregNoel)>     I'm still up, although I had a flash a few minutes ago 
19:22:02  <bdbaddog>     i'm still up too. 
19:22:08  <garyo-home>   ok, that's the current sheet anyway.   
19:22:17  <[GregNoel](GregNoel)>     Oops, I just went down 
19:22:24  <garyo-home>   Can I ask quickly about schedule?  1.0 is soon, then what? 
19:22:38  <[GregNoel](GregNoel)>     1.0.1 
19:22:52  <stevenknight> three-four weeks later, i should think 
19:23:02  <[GregNoel](GregNoel)>     two weeks to a checkpoint, then push it out a week later 
19:23:18  <garyo-home>   OK, so we start work on those tickets as soon as 1.0 is out and see how far we get. 
19:23:38  <garyo-home>   Greg: I like that schedule.  I'll be out for a week in mid-Sept though for work. 
19:23:46  <[GregNoel](GregNoel)>     I figure we clear about one issue a day between us, so no more than 15-20 issues in 1.0.1 
19:24:00  <garyo-home>   Probably right. 
19:24:31  <garyo-home>   I can do more in a burst but then real life intrudes for a while. 
19:24:46  <[GregNoel](GregNoel)>     Should we talk about the Python floor while waiting for Google to return? 
19:24:46  <stevenknight> agreed 
19:25:10  <garyo-home>   My google is back.  But I think 2.3 is OK. 
19:25:26  <stevenknight> garyo, if i can actually push out 1.0 tonight or tomorrow, do you have cycles to help w/re-branching this week? 
19:25:30  <garyo-home>   We can backport fixes to 1.0 for old python users if they scream. 
19:25:54  <garyo-home>   Steven: not really, but I'll make some.  It's important. 
19:25:54  <[GregNoel](GregNoel)>     And the Olympics will conflict for the next two weeks, so fixing issues will be slower; my [TiVo](TiVo) is recording 20 hours a day 
19:26:08  <stevenknight> what's in 2.3 that's really crucial / helpful for internal coding? 
19:26:15  <garyo-home>   I'm olympics agnostic, so it doesn't affect me at all. 
19:26:26  <bdbaddog>     ditto (re olympics) 
19:26:42  <[GregNoel](GregNoel)>     The built-in @ stuff on functions 
19:26:52  <stevenknight> decorators? 
19:26:57  <[GregNoel](GregNoel)>     yes 
19:27:24  <[GregNoel](GregNoel)>     It was a royal pain trying to backport tarfile to 2.2, since it uses a lot of decorators 
19:27:35  <[GregNoel](GregNoel)>     and I never did get all of the unused stuff to work 
19:27:56  <stevenknight> i see 
19:28:33  <stevenknight> absent data to the contrary, not sure if tarfile itself is all that compelling, though 
19:28:34  *      garyo-home is looking at release notes 
19:29:45  <[GregNoel](GregNoel)>     I was going to research it before the meeting, but when did 2.2 and 2.3 come out?  I think 2.2 is 2003, so that's five years ago. 
19:29:55  <stevenknight> sounds about right 
19:30:16  <stevenknight> oh, no 
19:30:25  <stevenknight> 2.2 was 21 December 2001 
19:30:35  <stevenknight> 2.3 was 29 July 2003 
19:30:56  <[GregNoel](GregNoel)>     OS X is the system fielding the oldest Python I'm aware of, and it had 2.3 in 10.4; 10.5 has 2.5 
19:31:22  <[GregNoel](GregNoel)>     so 2.3 is what I was recalling; that's already a bit old. 
19:32:07  <garyo-home>   sets, generators, and a bunch of module changes are what I see in the relnotes. 
19:32:07  <stevenknight> how about we poll the ML? 
19:32:08  <bdbaddog>     RH3 has 2.2.3 
19:32:33  <[GregNoel](GregNoel)>     I think 2.3 is very reasonable, particularly if we don't release 2.0 until 2009; 2.3 will already be almost six years old 
19:32:47  <garyo-home>   @bdbaddog: Really?  We actually use that.  But we may have upgraded the python on it. 
19:32:59  <[GregNoel](GregNoel)>     will [RedHat](RedHat) be updated before 2009? 
19:33:13  <stevenknight> [GregNoel](GregNoel):  doesn't matter 
19:33:16  <garyo-home>   Greg: RH3 is already ancient. 
19:33:34  <stevenknight> the issue isn't what the cutting edge has, it's how much of the old stuff still exists in enterprise development shops and on user sites 
19:33:51  <stevenknight> we have some time before deciding, so i'd suggest we poll the ML 
19:34:02  <garyo-home>   RH is up to 8 or 9 now.  4 is considered minimal standard by our customers (it has at least 2.3 I'm sure) 
19:34:04  <stevenknight> and also follow-up with a reporting module in SCons that lets people send data back to us 
19:34:06  <stevenknight> if they choose 
19:34:09  <bdbaddog>     rh4 is 2.3.4 
19:34:34  <bdbaddog>     RH5 is 2.4.3 
19:34:53  <bdbaddog>     RH4 is the mainstream in EDA now. 
19:34:59  <bdbaddog>     with some on RH5 
19:35:24  <garyo-home>   Our customers are visual effects people, RH4 is mainstream there.  Little RH3 left. 
19:35:35  <stevenknight> garyo-home:  little or none? 
19:36:08  <garyo-home>   little.  Still some diehards.  But shouldn't use that as a guide, they're not going to run scons. 
19:36:41  <garyo-home>   Polling the ML seems like a good idea. 
19:37:02  <stevenknight> right 
19:37:11  <garyo-home>   Can we start into the 2006h1 spreadsheet? 
19:37:12  <stevenknight> should that be a TASK issue so it doesn't get lost? 
19:37:12  <bdbaddog>     yes. For me and all the clients I've ever had building new python,perl, whatever for use by build system hasn't ever been an issue, though sometimes it had to be staged. 
19:37:18  <[GregNoel](GregNoel)>     I'd suggest setting the warning floor to 2.3 and see if anyone makes noise 
19:37:24  <stevenknight> i'll open it 
19:37:30  <bdbaddog>     Sounds good. 
19:37:32  <garyo-home>   stevennight: good. 
19:37:34  <stevenknight> [GregNoel](GregNoel):  good idea 
19:37:35  <bdbaddog>     I'm off for a bit back in a while. 
19:37:59  <[GregNoel](GregNoel)>     Google is back; I have 2006H1 up 
19:38:17  <garyo-home>   me too.  1307 is the first one. 
19:38:44  <[GregNoel](GregNoel)>     only 20 issues are still live 
19:38:53  <stevenknight> 1307:  anytime, p2, Ludwig? 
19:39:03  <garyo-home>   ok w/ me 
19:39:14  <[GregNoel](GregNoel)>     done, although GSoC is almost over 
19:39:28  *      stevenknight nods 
19:39:33  <stevenknight> 1308:  FIXED 
19:39:37  <garyo-home>   Hopefully we can rope him in as a regular contributor. 
19:40:00  <stevenknight> that'd be cool 
19:40:03  <stevenknight> 1310:  WONTFIX 
19:40:07  <[GregNoel](GregNoel)>     yes 
19:40:12  <garyo-home>   yes. 
19:40:35  <stevenknight> 1318:  WONTFIX? 
19:40:39  <stevenknight> actually, doc the solution 
19:40:40  <garyo-home>   agreed. 
19:40:45  <garyo-home>   yes, w/ doc. 
19:40:48  <[GregNoel](GregNoel)>     done 
19:41:09  <[GregNoel](GregNoel)>     1320 
19:41:10  <stevenknight> 1320:  WORKSFORME 
19:41:17  <garyo-home>   agreed. 
19:41:17  <[GregNoel](GregNoel)>     done 
19:41:36  <stevenknight> 1323:  anytime 
19:41:36  <[GregNoel](GregNoel)>     1323, was just on the mailing list... 
19:41:50  <stevenknight> oh, yeah 
19:42:03  <[GregNoel](GregNoel)>     wait a sec; let me look 
19:42:40  <[GregNoel](GregNoel)>     [axel_0001@gmx.de](mailto:axel_0001@gmx.de) Axel W. 
19:42:54  <stevenknight> shall we assign it to him and see if that gets him more involved? 
19:43:06  <garyo-home>   Interesting idea. 
19:43:18  <[GregNoel](GregNoel)>     I'm for it; he must have a Tigris ID 
19:43:20  <stevenknight> it's a future thing anyway 
19:43:24  <garyo-home>   If he drops it we're no worse off than today. 
19:43:28  <stevenknight> right 
19:43:29  <[GregNoel](GregNoel)>     concur 
19:43:33  <stevenknight> greg, could you follow up w/him? 
19:43:37  <[GregNoel](GregNoel)>     yes 
19:43:47  <[GregNoel](GregNoel)>     so Axel anytime? 
19:43:50  <stevenknight> done 
19:43:58  <garyo-home>   1328: I can do that one I think. 
19:43:59  <stevenknight> 1328:  1.x p4 garyo 
19:44:04  <[GregNoel](GregNoel)>     done 
19:44:19  <stevenknight> 1331:  FIXED 
19:44:36  <stevenknight> 1332:  1.x, p2, who? 
19:44:56  <garyo-home>   I think you have to do that one, Steven. 
19:45:12  <[GregNoel](GregNoel)>     I don't know the code at all, so I agree 
19:46:06  <[GregNoel](GregNoel)>     hello? 
19:46:19  <garyo-home>   silence... 
19:46:38  <garyo-home>   Maybe Steven's looking at the code? 
19:46:47  <stevenknight> sorry, other distraction 
19:46:55  <[GregNoel](GregNoel)>     it happens 
19:47:04  <stevenknight> agree i don't have to do 1332 
19:47:11  <stevenknight> sorry, have to do 
19:47:19  <[GregNoel](GregNoel)>     done 
19:47:24  <stevenknight> 1332: 1.x, p2, sk 
19:47:46  <stevenknight> 1344:  1.x, p3, mati 
19:47:51  <garyo-home>   Mati's looking into 1334, not sure of his status on it. 
19:47:56  <garyo-home>   sorry 1344 
19:48:09  <[GregNoel](GregNoel)>     anytime, mati? 
19:48:21  <[GregNoel](GregNoel)>     it's GSoC 
19:48:28  <garyo-home>   Yes. 
19:48:29  <stevenknight> i'm okay w/anytime 
19:48:40  <[GregNoel](GregNoel)>     1345 
19:48:57  <stevenknight> 1345:  2.x, p3, defer who 
19:49:07  <garyo-home>   good idea. 
19:49:30  <[GregNoel](GregNoel)>     ok, I barely remember it. 
19:49:52  <stevenknight> 1346:  anytime, mati 
19:49:54  <garyo-home>   no, I meant good idea not to pick someone now :-) 
19:50:04  <stevenknight> :-) 
19:50:08  <garyo-home>   yes.  I need to catch up w/ him since my vacation. 
19:50:16  <[GregNoel](GregNoel)>     yes 
19:50:43  <stevenknight> 1350:  1.x, p4, stevenknight 
19:50:50  <[GregNoel](GregNoel)>     done 
19:50:53  <garyo-home>   agreed. 
19:51:14  <stevenknight> 1351:  2.x, p4, gregnoel? 
19:51:22  <[GregNoel](GregNoel)>     done 
19:51:23  <garyo-home>   1351: as soon as we can use tarfile() 
19:51:28  <stevenknight> yes 
19:51:53  <stevenknight> 1365:  FIXED 
19:52:18  <garyo-home>   yes, and 1377: wontfix. 
19:52:31  <stevenknight> 1377:  consensus WONTFIX 
19:52:39  <[GregNoel](GregNoel)>     done 
19:52:25  <bdbaddog>     I'm off for the evening. Steven I'll see u at baypiggies 
19:52:38  <stevenknight> cool, thanks bill 
19:52:41  <garyo-home>   bye Bill. 
19:52:45  <[GregNoel](GregNoel)>     later 
19:53:08  <garyo-home>   1382, no good easy general solution. 
19:53:13  <stevenknight> agreed 
19:53:47  <stevenknight> do we even detect it and handle it gracefully? 
19:53:59  <garyo-home>   *Maybe* .sconsign could be chowned to real uid on linux/mac though. 
19:54:13  <[GregNoel](GregNoel)>     That would help most of the issues 
19:54:24  <[GregNoel](GregNoel)>     If you can find them. 
19:54:21  <garyo-home>   I could do that. 
19:54:42  <stevenknight> 1382:  1.x, p3, garyo? 
19:54:42  <[GregNoel](GregNoel)>     Even better would be to remove .sconsign before writing it. 
19:55:00  <garyo-home>   Can't remove it if owned by root unless perms are loose. 
19:55:19  <garyo-home>   Anyway, could probably do a bit better than today. 
19:55:30  <garyo-home>   I'll look into it. 
19:55:32  <[GregNoel](GregNoel)>     directory perms control delete; can remove file owned by anyone 
19:55:42  <stevenknight> if you own the dir 
19:56:00  <[GregNoel](GregNoel)>     you have to have write on the dir; you need that anyway to build 
19:56:01  <stevenknight> or rather, if dir's perms permit it 
19:56:23  <stevenknight> true if the .sconsign is in the same directory 
19:56:31  <stevenknight> which of course it usually is... 
19:56:43  <garyo-home>   greg: not true that dir perms control delete, I just tried it on ubuntu. 
19:56:59  <[GregNoel](GregNoel)>     I'll bet money; check my .sig 
19:57:13  <garyo-home>   jars@jars-desktop:/tmp$ sudo touch foo 
19:57:15  <garyo-home>   [sudo] password for jars:  
19:57:17  <garyo-home>   jars@jars-desktop:/tmp$ sudo chown root.root foo 
19:57:19  <garyo-home>   jars@jars-desktop:/tmp$ sudo chmod 444 foo 
19:57:20  <garyo-home>   jars@jars-desktop:/tmp$ rm foo 
19:57:22  <garyo-home>   rm: remove write-protected regular empty file `foo'? y 
19:57:23  <garyo-home>   rm: cannot remove `foo': Operation not permitted 
19:58:08  <[GregNoel](GregNoel)>      /tmp is special; try it on another directory 
19:58:24  <stevenknight> right, without sticky bit set 
19:58:56  <garyo-home>   wow, you're right.  I bow to your l33t sk1llz. 
19:59:18  <[GregNoel](GregNoel)>     133t? 
19:59:27  <stevenknight> leet == elite 
19:59:28  <garyo-home>   =elite 
19:59:59  <[GregNoel](GregNoel)>     oh.  thanks for the compliment.  I think... 
19:59:50  <stevenknight> h4x0r speak 
20:00:14  <[GregNoel](GregNoel)>     better translate that, too, for my simple mind 
20:00:25  <garyo-home>   hacker 
20:00:39  <stevenknight> (garyo and I sound *so* with it for guys as long in the tooth as we actually are...  :-)) 
20:00:46  <[GregNoel](GregNoel)>     more likely cracker... 
20:00:55  <garyo-home>   mmm, I just read Megatokyo :-) 
20:01:22  <[GregNoel](GregNoel)>     Man, you guys are making me feel ancient! 
20:01:16  <stevenknight> anyway, 1382:  1.x, p3, garyo? 
20:01:25  <garyo-home>   anyway, 1 or 2 more tonight?  Yes, I'll take 1382. 
20:01:42  <stevenknight> 1385:  1.x, p3, garyo 
20:02:01  <[GregNoel](GregNoel)>     I'll go for that 
20:02:02  <garyo-home>   Yeah, that one will take a bit of work but worth it. 
20:02:07  <stevenknight> 1388:  uhh...  not sure 
20:02:13  <stevenknight> not me not me not me 
20:02:17  <stevenknight> please please please 
20:02:24  <stevenknight> make the unicode stop hurting 
20:02:26  <garyo-home>   Maybe more recent python will help? 
20:02:34  <[GregNoel](GregNoel)>     not to my knowledge. 
20:02:46  <stevenknight> help a little, but someone on the ML explained that this is a really really thorny problem 
20:02:53  <[GregNoel](GregNoel)>     stevenknight, do you know the sound a weasel makes as it dies? 
20:03:00  <stevenknight> pop? 
20:03:15  <[GregNoel](GregNoel)>     (squeeky voice) not me not me not me 
20:04:06  <[GregNoel](GregNoel)>     I guess you have to be there 
20:04:15  <stevenknight> ah, got it -- took a little while 
20:04:36  <stevenknight> 1388:  1.x p3 to reevaluate 
20:04:46  <garyo-home>   ok w/ me. 
20:04:49  <[GregNoel](GregNoel)>     anyway, i18n is a huge job 
20:04:57  <stevenknight> right 
20:04:59  <[GregNoel](GregNoel)>     maybe even later than that 
20:05:06  <stevenknight> i keep hoping some hero will show up... 
20:05:13  <[GregNoel](GregNoel)>     somebody needs to research it, a hero 
20:05:23  <[GregNoel](GregNoel)>     ah, that's what you said! 
20:05:23  <stevenknight> 1388:  1.x, p3, hero 
20:05:33  <garyo-home>   don't look in my direction 
20:05:38  <[GregNoel](GregNoel)>     ok, I'll figure something out 
20:05:43  <stevenknight> hey, i kind of like the idea of a nameless "hero" that we can assign things to... 
20:05:57  <[GregNoel](GregNoel)>     except that they wouldn't get done... 
20:06:10  <stevenknight> oh, details... :-) 
20:06:18  <garyo-home>   ok guys, I'm getting punchy.  Time for me to go to bed. 
20:06:25  <stevenknight> sounds good 
20:06:25  <[GregNoel](GregNoel)>     let's defer it until next time and see if we can kill the rest 
20:06:30  <stevenknight> agreed 
20:06:33  <stevenknight> same time next week? 
20:06:42  <garyo-home>   OK, same time next week is ok for me. 
20:06:50  <[GregNoel](GregNoel)>     ok 
20:07:05  <stevenknight> all right -- good night, all 
20:07:07  <[GregNoel](GregNoel)>     pick up here with i18n? 
20:07:10  <stevenknight> yes 
20:07:16  <[GregNoel](GregNoel)>     cu then 
20:07:16  <garyo-home>   l8r :-) 
20:07:17  <stevenknight> and I'll go close #1500 
20:07:23  <stevenknight> :-) good one 
20:07:24  <[GregNoel](GregNoel)>     thanks 
20:07:35  *      stevenknight has quit ("Leaving") 
20:07:58  <[GregNoel](GregNoel)>     'nite Gary; I'm off for more Olympics 
20:08:07  <garyo-home>   have fun! 
20:08:14  <[GregNoel](GregNoel)>     I'll do that 
20:08:08  *      [GregNoel](GregNoel) has been marked as being away 
20:08:18  *      garyo-home has quit ("[ChatZilla](ChatZilla) 0.9.83 [Firefox 3.0.1/2008070208]") 

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