Territories and stuff

Issue #136 open
taxman
created an issue

Not quite self explanatory title but i can't cram it all into single word - few questions, few thoughts, ideas, although i'll try to skip bugs :D I recall that werejew prefers people to use bitbucket and post here - fine by me, everything is better than discussing in Moddb comment section...

So here we go. Territory priority in Warfare options - in addition to base and resource ones. Does it mean that finally territory smarts will be used? What about planned patrols feature? Is it time to come back to my simulation_props balancing project? XD Reminder - only base smarts were able to both keep and spawn squads(+plus resource smarts where you could send squad, but these weren't able to create new npc). So whole system and balance depended on whether certain smart was used as base or lair etc. which was intended for vanilla a-life system. As for Warfare - not exactly. In some areas the base-type smarts were too common, resulting mayhem and squads spawning at every shithole, while missing in some others. I did some adjustments to simulation_object_props file in attempt to balance stuff a little, mainly reduced number of base(sadly leaving them mostly unused), created few new, add resources etc... I didn't want new fresh troops popping out of every corner all the time, but also to not disable some spots from taking part in Warfare. Unfortunately there was not big use of territory points at the moment.

First, IMO base should bigger than some fookin surrounded by sleeping bags barrel in the middle of the bushes or abandoned camp. Besides obvious examples like Bar or Skadovsk, it doesn't even have to be an entire building but come on, at least one wall or so ;/ In my vision, these real, proper base need to be very rare - fewer the better if ask me ;D Eg. one/max two per level, but best if even less - making them really important and valuable, hard to gain but very rewarding if so, hard and painful if loss. But it can be role of the Headquarters feature that i suggested while ago. Not necessarily restrict respawn only to them but limit it a bit. Eg: at the Marshes leave main CS, additionally maybe Car Park too(that with mg). The rest will work as resources(anomalies, strategically located places, access to traders etc.) or as territories - which can be visit by patrols but also be use to defense - after introducing some sort of economy system - cause it will not be free and player will must decide whether to fortify his own positions or o to attack. Along with the increasing power of faction it will be able to maintain more posts and garrisons - but that also means extensive borders and more of the precious resources that need protection. I have some don't want to make more mess in one topic.

Comments (6)

  1. xarshi repo owner
    • changed status to open

    I'm currently working on writing the patrol system this very moment actually. That will be the next code I commit to the repo, hopefully today or tomorrow or the next day lol. Every base will get X amount of patrol squads, where x is its max population. This will allow people to control patrol count by using the stalker population factor variable. Those squads will then choose the N closest territory points, and will travel between those points. The effect this will create is that bases will have squads moving around their area, causing factions to have a much more noticeable presence in an area, making lowering of respawn rates for invasions more palatable since you'll still have plenty of skirmishes when random patrols encounter each other (two enemy bases near by will clash as they will likely have common territory points they are trying to patrol). Once this code is in, territory points will become a much bigger deal, though I don't think they will ever be truly "held" by squads, short of patrol squads staying at a territory point for a few in-game minutes or something. I've been saying for a while that I'll be cutting down the number of bases, I just haven't gotten around to it yet. I'll be going through and removing areas that don't really make sense; my goal is to have that ready for when patrols are ready. Warfare will change in tone after that update most likely, and feel more lively. I likely won't remove a significant amount of bases (well, I guess not an insignificant amount either), but I definitely agree that they shouldn't be random camps in the woods haha. Hell, if you want to go and start identifying places that ARE bases and DONT have any walls or structure, I'd appreciate it.

  2. taxman reporter

    Cool, it should make everything more dynamic and unpredictable and force to be careful everywhere instead of only avoiding known enemy bases or ongoing invasions. However maybe patrols should stay at territories for a while longer - ingame day/half, or just for the night to sleep time or so... Most of the territory smarts are kind of such camps, which stalkers like to visit and rest there but aren't suitable to be permanently inhabit. But you can never be sure if someone is at post at the moment.

    Sure no problem, i'll try to redo some stuff in free time. But remains balance question, also personally i use modified simulation.ltx file with factions initial spawn only in their main starting places(Bar for Duty, Escape for Loners etc.) similary to old Warfare system - seems that vanilla CoC spawn doesn't fits to Warfare. My idea in general is to make faction base feel like an actual base - heavily defended home, with proper infrastructure to maintain command or to recruit and train new squads. I realize though that there is too few places meeting those conditions while plenty of others that shoud be use somehow - so maybe in the future can be implement different types of base: mentioned major ones working as faction headquarters and also more common smaller bases with lower respawn rate/capable to send invasion squads only to own level or just patrols. Nevertheless for now i try to find some compromise ;D

  3. xarshi repo owner

    I'll be making the patrol squads minimum and maximum idle time adjustable, that way the player can choose. I'll include an option to pause patrols at night (or possibly just have a percentage chance they move forward with their patrol at night so users can configure it to their liking).

    The unfortunate issue with defensive structures is that, as far as I'm aware, you can't add stuff like that at runtime and allow the AI to maneuver around it and use it as cover. I could be wrong, but I don't think I am.

    That actually is a good idea with the restricted spawns. I'll make a couple custom simulation.ltx files that warfare will load and use depending on which options the player choose. As for the headquarters concept, they are technically (kinda?) in now, though they are just considered both resources AND bases. And I think there is like only one lol. I'll likely add in that distinction though, that way factions can have bases which are far more important and that they will prioritize over any other base. As for making bases stronger and more intimidating, I can simply have it so that they have lowered spawn times and more patrols.

    As for the whole invasion thing, I can easily make it so that only headquarters can stage cross-level invasions, but if I do that I feel it will lead to more deterministic behavior for the AI (perhaps not a bad thing), But thats what options are for I suppose - allowing people to opt out of features.

    I think most of the patrol stuff is finished, gonna be testing that out tonight. So hopefully I'll be able to get that released by this weekend along with an updated Warfare Options menu utilizing tabs instead of an endless list of variables.

  4. MJ20393

    Can you make patrols population be 50% of max base population? Its kinda breaking immersion if you have 6 squads resting and 6 squads patroling around in a base that has max population 6. Too many fighters around. There wont be any chance sliping through enemy area undetected which means you must operate only in areas which your faction control. It would be very boring playing it with ironman on.

    Or.... Maybe you could make it possible to clink on a base and decide how many squads you want to patrol from that base. They would still count as population of that base but they would go around nearby territories. Using this way would allow to factions to be different on from another. Fir example, some factions would turtle holding all squads in main base and some factions would prefer spreading around without very strong central base.

  5. taxman reporter
    1. Custom edited simulation_object_props.ltx for Warfare. I did this considering implement of patrols feature - which should make some use of territory-type smarts. Also base + resource smarts are my proposals of major bases/headquarters or whatever call it. Wasn't sure about underground ones, i wasn't able to check them on map and and I didn't want to go to every underground level by myself(maybe i will next time). I assumed that every underground is suitable as base. In the future, when patrols or/and headquarter system will be implemented i may change and balance this once more. PS: I can't remember anymore what effects have "resource" smarts in specific? Also how it was with the owned levels count?
    2. Personal preset(was requested to share own presets), please go ahead if you want add it to presets dir in next release. Not very different from the default, few adjustments based on lore(more powerful and expansive actual factions(Duty, Freedom, Monolith), but slight chance of resurgence of "ordinary population" of Zone - Loners, Bandits, Mercs, Army... PS2: How "auto capture" option work?
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